MAG79 wrote:

Blackfyre
I believe you have compared 48 Hz custom mode and 50 Hz speedup mode. What do you think?

Oh I haven't tried speed up since I switched to RIFE, I did before RIFE and it was fine. I might give it a try, but I am very happy with 48FPS @ 48Hz

Chainik wrote:

trying to figure the best default model now
and it looks like 4.6 is still the best default choice

100% keep 4.6 as the default for everyone. Because then people will complain all of a sudden their RIFE is lagging if it changes the default with an update haha!

Most 'advanced' users already know how to change them.

Maybe you can add the 'extra options'. Such as Rife 4.16 Lite v2 and 4.18 in the drop down menu with 4.9 as well, but keep 4.6 as default.

Chainik wrote:

ok, 4.18 is also two times slower, and it's also recommended by the model creator
is it two times better?

Is it two times better? It depends, I have always been sensitive to artifacts, since old SVP days I used to always try to minimise artifacts haha

So to some of us, it is a lot more than 2x better.

In terms of 'smoothness', not much difference, very similar between all RIFE versions. In terms of artifact masking, much much better.

Hottea wrote:
MAG79 wrote:

Hottea
Use frame downscale in SVP.
You need to press and hold mouse button to select resolution from the list.

Thanks, it runs smoothly now. But i wonder does downscaling mean now i run 4k source at 1080p 60hz?

@Blackfyre: I tried to run 24hz source with rife 4.6 but it still stutter badly, gpu usage fluctuates between 100% and much lower. My 3090 is already undervolted and +1200mhz on memory clock stable. Normal svp runs 4k 60hz no problem but since experiencing rife's smoothness i cant come back to normal svp anymore. Maybe we need 4090 to experience 4k 60hz glory smile)
Thankss

Oh this goes without saying 60 FPS is impossible with a 3090 at 4K.

I create a custom resolution with a custom refresh rate that's 48Hz using CRU. Switch HDR on, switch refresh rate to 48Hz, and then I play my content using 2x from source, so 48 FPS always to match the custom refresh rate for perfect smoothness.

48 FPS with RIFE feels and looks smoother than 120 FPS without.

Hottea wrote:

Any option to run Rife(4.15 lite) with 4k source video?
Im using a 3090 and 4k to 60hz is impossible, lag like hell.
thanks

Edit: Information below is for 2x, running with a custom refresh rate of 48Hz at 48FPS.

3090 owner here. I hate downscaling so here are some tips to run 4K.

First of all, forget about 25 FPS or higher at full 4K with newer RIFE versions (hopefully they optimise better in the future). The source has to be 24FPS (which is most shows and movies anyway). You can create a profile for 25 FPS or higher to run old RIFE such as version 4.6 for example.

I use one profile which is: 4.16 Lite v2 for full screen 4K content, Performance Boost enabled. Scene change detection set to SVP motion vectors.

I have a second profile which is 4.18 v2 with Apply this profile IF "Frame Height" ≤ 1700

If you know how to overclock/undervolt, GPU memory overclock helps RIFE a lot, so for example I undervolt my GPU and run +1050Mhz overclock on memory (depending on your GPU, this might be unstable for you so try +700). I have this profile on MSI Afterburner for when I watch movies/shows with a custom fan curve to keep the GPU quiet too.

I use MPV to watch content and here are my current MPV Config:

ontop
fullscreen=yes
d3d11-exclusive-fs=yes

volume=100
volume-max=100

vo=gpu-next
gpu-api=d3d11
hwdec=auto-copy
hwdec-codecs=all
gpu-context=d3d11
fbo-format=rgba16hf

hdr-compute-peak=no
tone-mapping=st2094-40
target-colorspace-hint=yes

scale=ewa_lanczos
cscale=ewa_lanczos
dscale=ewa_lanczos
tscale=ewa_lanczos

glsl-shader="C:\Users\USERNAME\AppData\Roaming\mpv\Shaders\FSRCNNX_x2_8-0-4-1.glsl"
glsl-shader="C:\Users\USERNAME\AppData\Roaming\mpv\Shaders\KrigBilateral.glsl"
glsl-shader="C:\Users\USERNAME\AppData\Roaming\mpv\Shaders\SSimDownscaler.glsl"

oriento wrote:

I made a small test, 4.22lite show less artifact (on a specific scene with repeated patterns) than 4.16lite

I found the opposite, weird artifacts re-introduced in scenes that were previously fixed. Went back to 4.16_lite (v2) as it has been my main one since its release.

Another thing I forgot to mention V2 versions perform better, if they do not work for you, there is a guide here in this thread about how to make V2's work.

lurker wrote:

but have HUGE lags with 3840x2160@25fps

25FPS to 50FPS (2X) is more demanding, a lot more than you would think compared to 24FPS for some reason.

For example, I always have to run 25FPS content with older RIFE models, such as 4.9, than the one I am currently using 4.16_lite (v2).

You can create a copy of your RIFE profile, rename it to 25 FPS for example, and set an "Apply this profile IF..." and choose "Video frame rate", then change to "greater than" and choose 25 FPS and for that you choose the model that works for it.

dlr5668 wrote:

downscale 4k to manageable resolution like 1440p then use nvidia VSR (quality 1 or 2) to get 4k

This IMO is horrible. But if someone prefers smoothness over quality, then 100% the correct method.

lurker wrote:

Which rife model is the fastest? I want to try 4k on 3080ti

Remember the first time you run any resolution you have to allow RIFE to build its cache, this will take a while but it only happens ONE time for each resolution.

The only three you should test are:

4.6 - old stable one we used for a while

4.9 - another very stable one that performed well. Might be the best one you can use.

4.16_lite (v2) - pushes my RTX 3090 to the limit while allows me to watch 4K.

Create a custom refresh rate of 48Hz using CRU (you have learn how), if you have an LG TV I can help you.

Before I watch, I switch to 48Hz, enable HDR, and then enjoy.

Also some things I found out. If you overclock, memory overclocking helps RIFE a lot. I was able to achieve much better temperatures by overclocking my memory on the RTX 3090, and downclocking the core. Allows me to watch movies and TV shows while the PC remains relatively silent and inaudible compared to the speaker volume.

Insindro wrote:

What are your top 3-5 rife models and miscellaneous settings for scene changes? Just want to get a good idea of what everyone is currently using, thanks!

I don't have a 4090, but for my RTX 3090, the one and only model that works at 4K x 2 with the best quality = 4.16_Lite(v2) has been the primary one since it was released.

dawkinscm wrote:

Rife v4.20 has been released. I didn't do a large amount of testing but I did check the few remaining artefacts I know of and there doesn't seem to be a clear  difference to v4.15/v4.18 on my system.

Update: Apparently v4.20 is great when using 16x interpolation with Anime. I would be interested to hear if that is helpful for anyone.

Massive difference in size! wow hopefully I can run 4K 2x with a 3090, but I highly doubt it. Usually I have to wait for the Lite v2, but even then, not all of them can run.

Insindro wrote:

Thanks for this. How would I go about enabling Dolby vision and how would I check if it’s on? My tv supports it and HDR is on but I don’t think Dolby vision is for DV content in mpv.

You're welcome.

Change hdr-compute-peak=yes to no instead. There is some HDR content that flickers with hdr-compute turned on for me on my LG C2. But maybe it depends on the monitor/TV, so keep it on, but if you notice flickering in some scenes, switch it to off.

If the colours, brightness, and black levels look good, and there is no banding, then Dolby Vision is working fine. But while using MPV, turn on CAPS lock, press i on the keyboard and it will show up the stats (information) which reveals what's being used next to colormatrix it should say dolbyvision. Turning on CAPS lock allows the information screen to stay up without fading away, pressing i again will make it go away. Without CAPS lock enabled, it comes on for a few seconds then goes away.

dawkinscm wrote:

How are you using FSRCNNX because by default because it doesn't work unless there's at least 2x scaling required. Is it listed your in your mpv page 2 stats?

1080p to 4K content, such as Arcane (Netflix) when testing RIFE versions or when watching old content. Some old favourites like Everybody Loves Raymond, Friends, etc are all not 4K content too.

Otherwise at 4K, mpv will automatically use the internal scaler, for example I have mine set to ewa_lanczos in the config, which btw:

Source for quote below: https://github.com/mpv-player/mpv/wiki/GPU-Next-vs-GPU

ewa_lanczos defaults to using radius 3.2383  in gpu-next, rather than the radius 3.0 of gpu.

dawkinscm wrote:

As I said before, machine generated scores doesn't guarantee the best looking picture because human perception and preference isn't objective. The other thing I said is that much of this is designed specifically for Anime and that definitely applies to ArtCNN. So hopefully you are an Anime watcher smile

Also don't forget there are different levels to it, for example I would never use strongest FSRCNNX because it would introduce too much sharpness for non-Anime. However, the one I do use, is always very helpful in improving the sharpness just a little a bit because I have the TV sharpness set to 0 on the LG C2.

TV sharpness is much worse than these AI shaders btw, so actually using the shaders as an alternative and toning down the TV ones definitely helps.

In most cases though, I imagine people here use monitors, which automatically have sharpness set to 0.

It also wouldn't make sense to use these upscalers on a 27" or 32" 4K monitor, as again like @dawkinscm says, it would look too sharp.

However, watching on a 42" screen, and I have been using 42" and 43" screens for almost a decade now, I started using FSRCNNX in its very early days and have not looked back, it is great.

So, a lot of factors play a role, no harm in testing and seeing what you prefer.

For reference, I use FSRCNNX_x2_8-0-4-1.glsl, which is the 8- and it's very low sharpness compared to the 16- and 32-.

oriento wrote:

New version
4.19 (Add SportsSlomo) - 2024.07.12

Tested v2, worse than 4.16v2 (which is the main one I use). So back to 4.16v2 for me.

@Chainik changing hdr-compute-peak=yes to no in MPV config solves HDR flickering in problematic non-DV HDR content, for example the bluray of Ant-Man and the Wasp: Quantumania. Sending the HDR metadata directly to the display I guess instead of it being processed by MPV.

It has no impact on DV though, yes or no, it appears the same exactly (stutter instead of flicker now). Is MPV always processing DV metadata? Maybe that causes an issue, not sure, just letting you know in case you want to investigate it further.

dawkinscm wrote:

To be fair this is a very much cleaned up version. I'm curious if this different to the one I commented on because if it isn't then I owe you an apology smile

On this cleaned up version, you don't need  hwdecs-copy=all and you are not using tscale. On my setup, Error-diffussion in general isn't required for gpu-next coz Ordered works as well or better and costs almost zero resources. Again on my system, if error-diffusion is used then Burkes is worse than Floyd. After that the shaders are personal preference.

Good job big_smile

No that was the cleaned up version and thanks for extra info.

Xenocyde wrote:

What are these for exactly?

Scaling methodology.

Dithering methodology.

The shaders at the bottom (which have to be downloaded and added into a shaders folder separately) improve quality. FSRCNNX is an upscaler, while KrigBilateral is a chroma upscaler, SSimDownscaler is for downsampling.

You can read more about them on their pages. But also, if you want an article explaining them, as well as better shaders that are more demanding which I cannot run with an RTX 3090 while using RIFE, have a read through this: https://artoriuz.github.io/blog/mpv_upscaling.html

Chainik wrote:

Blackfyre
> Hopefully in the future you find a solution to the above as well, that would be amazing!

blinking comes from mixing two frames having different colors, so I don't see any solution for RIFE
... except inserting a "regular SVP"-generated frames at these points, but it sounds too complicated for now

Wow yeah that makes sense.

What is interesting is why does some DV content work ALMOST flawlessly with very little blinking or stutter in some TV shows, such as House of the Dragon, but then Disney TV shows with DV stutter so much now (flicker before)?

EDIT: Fixed as I just noticed it happening in very specific scenes in HoTD, but very limited.

So, I assume the answer is colour grading and luminance grading. The higher the quality and smoothness between frames, the less it occurs. And HotD is produced with very high quality.

dawkinscm wrote:
Blackfyre wrote:

For anyone interested, this is my mpv config now - you can scroll up and down in the code below to see the full config:

ontop 

dither=error-diffusion 
error-diffusion=burkes 

Thanks for this. There's nothing in your config that makes a difference for SVP and we've already had the discussion about config lines that essentially do nothing or are even contradictory. But if you are happy with the picture then I suppose it doesn't matter big_smile However I am interested in the error-diffusion you chose so I will try that out. Thanks smile

Can you point out the config lines that do nothing in my latest config, and also the ones that are contradictory and what they are contradicting? I would love to tone it down and clean it up. I thought this is the cleaned-up version as I removed and changed many of the old lines after the latest SVP update that fixed flickering.

I'll post the latest config here as a quote:

ontop
fullscreen=yes
d3d11-exclusive-fs=yes

volume=100
volume-max=100

vo=gpu-next
gpu-api=d3d11
hwdec=auto-copy
hwdec-codecs=all
gpu-context=d3d11

hdr-compute-peak=yes
tone-mapping=bt.2446a
target-colorspace-hint=yes

scale=ewa_lanczos
cscale=ewa_lanczos
dscale=ewa_lanczos
tscale=ewa_lanczos

dither-depth=10
dither=error-diffusion
error-diffusion=burkes

osd-color=0.5
osd-font-size=30
osd-font='Inter Tight Medium'

#sub-gray
sub-auto=fuzzy
#sub-gauss=0.9
slang=eng,en,und
sub-fix-timing=yes
sub-filter-sdh=yes
subs-with-matching-audio=no
demuxer-mkv-subtitle-preroll=yes

sub-font-size=42
sub-border-size=1
sub-font="Verdana Bold"
sub-color=0.85/0.85/0.85/0.85

sub-pos=100
sub-margin-y=3
sub-margin-x=100

glsl-shader="C:\Users\USERNAME\AppData\Roaming\mpv\Shaders\FSRCNNX_x2_8-0-4-1.glsl"
glsl-shader="C:\Users\USERNAME\AppData\Roaming\mpv\Shaders\KrigBilateral.glsl"
glsl-shader="C:\Users\USERNAME\AppData\Roaming\mpv\Shaders\SSimDownscaler.glsl"

Chainik wrote:

Blackfyre
> For some reason SVP smoothness does not work properly with them now.

this is the cost of non-blinking
it has to repeat frame when DV data changes, which may happen at random places

Oh! Interesting, well it happens a lot with Mandalorian S3E4, it has become my torture test the scene at the start with a lot of panning shots (first 3 or so minutes).

Hopefully in the future you find a solution to the above as well, that would be amazing!

Also, for me I have been using "SVP Motion Vectors" for Scene Change Detection since the latest update and I'm happy with it.

For anyone interested, this is my mpv config now - you can scroll up and down in the code below to see the full config:

Remove - updated in below post.

Regarding the below:

Chainik wrote:

> Is there anything we can do to increase NVOF and SVP algorithms strength

yep
smooth.scene.limits.scene
smooth.scene.limits.blocks

the bad thing is that values that work good with resizing to 720p doesn't seems to work with 1080p and 4K

I will experiment myself, but any recommendations for 4K content only? I always just watch 4K high bitrate content now. So, I want highest quality if there are further improvements. I am happy with default, but always interested in tweaking haha

Chainik wrote:

DolbyVision blinking must be fixed at last big_smile

plus DV colors (i.e. brightness) were incorrect because of wrong colorspace conversion before/after RIFE processing

Amazing huge difference with DV content, great work. Now I need to re-watch House of the Dragon lol feels like a new life has been given to it.

However, some Disney+ TV Shows DV now exhibit different behavior with DV. For some reason SVP smoothness does not work properly with them now. It looks like it is dropping frames every few seconds on panning shots, but there is 0 dropped and 0 delayed frames. Very weird. Only with Disney+ TV show I am testing, with House of the Dragon and others it is working fine.

42

(0 replies, posted in Using SVP)

Since the last update the volume bar is always outside of the frame of the window when I change volume, like the image below.

I tried to mess around with my config OSD settings, but nothing helped.

Any tip on how to lower it back into position?

https://i.imgur.com/aOkagdO.png

EDIT: Deleted / Wrong Info, forgot to switch refresh rate to Custom 48Hz before testing.

Drakko01 wrote:
Blackfyre wrote:
Drakko01 wrote:

I pointed out one example of this in Doctor Strange Multiverse of madness, after defender Strange is killed by the Ribboned Creature and America Chavez run underneath.

Can you provide the timestamp? I have that in high quality and I can test tomorrow.

3.06 and 3.16 the ribbons of the creature , maybe I misinterpreted and its something else.Thanks for taking the time.

Artifacts do not change for me, all 3 show very little artifacts with the 4K Bluray quality. If anything, SVP Motion Vectors maybe shows least.

However you are right, Image Comparison at 99% for me does appear to be the "smoothest" out of the 3 options.

SVP Motion Vectors in those specific time stamps makes the creature ribbons and America Chavez look as though they are dropping frames (even though there are no dropped frames at all), similar to Image Comparison when its set to very low percentages like 6% for example. But with custom 99% it is the smoothest always.

Drakko01 wrote:

I pointed out one example of this in Doctor Strange Multiverse of madness, after defender Strange is killed by the Ribboned Creature and America chavez run underneath.

Can you provide the timestamp? I have that in high quality and I can test tomorrow.

Because from my tests the other day, I did not find any issues with NVOF, or Motion Vectors, or Image Comparison = 99, all were the same for me on 4K high bitrate content, but I only done a bit of testing.

Chainik wrote:

apparently, DV blinking _was_ fixed, but it seems that now, with a processing logic changed for "motion vectors scene change", the blinking is back, but for a different reason big_smile and it's a different kind of blinking now...

still the latest "0.38" changes were necessary, but not enough

Interesting, well I have tested it for a while as you know and I have documented here before as well, Dolby Vision has never worked with RIFE correctly. Blinking was always present. At least for my setup, RTX 3090 + LG C2 OLED.

Curious what mpv config do you use? Do you mind sharing yours.

flowreen91 wrote:
dawkinscm wrote:

I tested using an MPV build from this week with the latest SVP update.

With the MPV update, your mpv.conf file reseted, probably you should apply your previous mpv optimizations to get back to the old performance (if u had any).

New Rife 4.18 here:
https://github.com/AmusementClub/vs-mlr … nal-models

Tested and 3090 not powerful enough to do 4K x 2, so I'm going back to 4.16_Lite_(v2) (most stable version for me in terms of performance). I will wait for 4.18_Lite_(v2) and see how it goes.

Interested for those who do tests to see if there are visual improvements with 4.18

@Chainik I saw your comment earlier so I was getting a video for you, but as it's deleted now, here is an example below (video included).

Scene Change is on repeat, I do not use blend with RIFE. So that is not an issue.

The below happens with exclusively Dolby Vision content always.

Constant flickering always. Default config, custom config, tried many combinations, doesn't stop it.

I say exclusively DV above because there are many examples of DV / HDR content, where it comes with both DV and HDR10 or 10+ metadata, so mpv automatically plays the one that works correctly. An example of this is the latest 4K HDR DV episodes of House of the Dragon, they all work perfectly fine. But Disney+ DV content will always flicker because it is DV exclusive I believe (at least this is how I understood why some DV work and others never work).

https://streamable.com/5fyn6a

I got so excited lol

Then I tested, and the blinking was still there, I assume this is not fixed for RIFE? But only for motion vector or NVOF methods? @Chainik

I tried with both my custom mpv config, and then I removed my config file to test with default, and both had heavy blinking with Dolby Vision exclusive files.

https://i.ibb.co/Kx6PPvG/Screenshot-2024-07-03-044915.png

dawkinscm wrote:

After a little more testing with v4.15, SC=8% with nvof is generally as good as turning off SC plus it helps with certain vertical fast motion artefacts. But  I'm hoping the next Rife model can improve here because nvof causes problems for another one of my other SC torture files. So back to setting SC higher than 10 or turning it off.

Chainik wrote:

the file attached there was updated 4 times already
the last time - yesterday

I've been meaning to ask, what are you guys doing lately? Somehow combining RIFE + Nvidia Optical Flow together?

I'm trying to follow the comments and not understanding it 100%

I would appreciate an explanation smile

dawkinscm wrote:
Blackfyre wrote:

So v2 in some instances definitely performs better, at least with my RTX 3090, I can even downclock and undervolt it and run a completely silent system that does not distract me at all now.

That's why I used v2 for so long. Half the GPU usage, half the noise. But I no longer need v2 now that I'm downscaling.

What is the purpose of down-scaling? Sure you gain performance, but you lose the quality of 4K, so why not get your content in 1080p and do native 1080p and you can push 3X for example or 4x with RIFE

The purpose of 4K HDR is to maintain that quality, otherwise it is not worth it to downscale imo