Topic: How to fix pan & scan judder?

Hey everyone,

I've been messing around with SVP for a few days, and have finally found a combination of settings between SVP, MPC-HC, and ReClock that is finally giving me playback without dropping frames in the middle of playback and no audio clipping at all. However but am still experiencing some video judder, and am wondering if there is a way I can fix that.

Reading around, I've heard probable causes such as mismatched framerate, bad graphics drivers, bad settings in madVR, ReClock, or SVP. Looking back through dozens of forum posts over several years, it seems to have been a hard problem to nail down. If I can get some pointers on how to further reduce, or ideally eliminate this judder, it'd be much appreciated.

The system I'm using has an Intel Core i7-6700K, NVIDIA GTX 1070, 32 GB of ram, and displaying on an ASUS VG248QE monitor. My current settings for SVP, madVR, and ReClock are included as well.

Post's attachments

madVR Settings_80.png, 194.84 kb, 250 x 561
madVR Settings_80.png 194.84 kb, 485 downloads since 2017-01-09 

SVP and ReClock Settings_80.png, 138.15 kb, 727 x 346
SVP and ReClock Settings_80.png 138.15 kb, 503 downloads since 2017-01-09 

Re: How to fix pan & scan judder?

> ASUS VG248QE monitor
I have the same wink

What source video framerate?

Re: How to fix pan & scan judder?

Nice! I'm liking it so far, but it's a shame Asus didn't get around to that g-sync module for most of us...but I digress lol.

Most of my media is 30 fps, but some others are 24 fps, or close to it anyway.

After doing some further digging last night, I compared the playback of one of my 720p files to one of my 1080p files, and the difference in smoothness is almost night and day. Besides minor artifacts, the 720p file played just about perfectly, minus some hiccups on video startup (exclusive mode in madVR perhaps?)

If I'm noticing this much of a difference in smoothness, could the problem just be my hardware? For a sanity check, I ran SVPmark and it came back with these results:

Test summary
-----------------------
  Date: 2017-01-10T06:50:06
  CPU:  Intel Core i7-6700K @4008 MHz [8 threads]
  GPU:  NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1070 [ver.376.33]
  Mode: FHD + GPU [17 threads]

Overall scores
-----------------------
  Synthetic CPU:                  MC3069
  Synthetic GPU:                  MG5296
  Real-life:                      FG3920

Details: synthetic
-----------------------
  CPU: compose (single-threaded): 839
  CPU: compose (multi-threaded):  3652
  CPU: search (single-threaded):  662
  CPU: search (multi-threaded):   2648
  GPU: system -> GPU transfer:    2234
  GPU: GPU -> system transfer:    2370
  GPU: calculations:              6114
  GPU: total score:               13079

Details: real-life /FHD
-----------------------
  decode video:                   22.61x (542.6 fps)
  48 fps - vectors search:        2.01x (96.4 fps)
  60 fps - frame composition:     5.11x (306.4 fps)
  48 fps - [SVP] fastest:         8.62x (413.7 fps)
  48 fps - [SVP] simple 1:        6.46x (310.3 fps)
  60 fps - [SVP] good:            3.48x (209.1 fps)
  60 fps - [SVP] high:            2.66x (159.6 fps)
  60 fps - [SVP] highest:         1.19x (71.2 fps)
  72 fps - [SVP] simple 2:        5.92x (426.5 fps)

From what I can tell, the CPU seems to be performing similarly to others, but I kinda expected the GPU to perform better, but I'm just not sure, really.

Re: How to fix pan & scan judder?

> I kinda expected the GPU to perform better
You are right. Frame interpolation with GPU-acceleration performed with better quality than without GPU.
To get better quality try use integer ratios in SVP.
For example:
to smooth 30 fps source use 120 Hz refreshrate and 30 x4 = 120 fps
to smooth 24 fps source use 120 Hz refreshrate and 24 x5 = 120 fps

> dropped frames 0
What pan & scan judder do you see?
The video must move flawless.

5 (edited by Nikolai Smirnoff 11-01-2017 08:26:36)

Re: How to fix pan & scan judder?

Today I tested out a new SVP profile with a 120 Hz refresh rate, comparing a 24 fps source to a 30 fps source. The 30 fps source still experiences judder when set to a x4 (120 fps) integer ratio. Interestingly, the 24 fps source played smoothly at x5 (120 fps) and x6 (144 fps) integer ratios.

Previously I thought that the 1080p resolution was impacting SVP performance, but I think this was merely a coincidence. As it turns out, both high res and low res sources with a 24 fps framerate are playing smoothly.

Doing further digging, I found out that not all of my 30 fps sources exhibited juddering. In one comparison, I noticed that a 30 fps anime trailer juddered, but a 30 fps video game trailer did not. This leads me to believe that this judder may be caused by how some anime on the internet is encoded. Since anime is produced at 24 fps, and this source material is encoded to a constant 30 fps framerate (for some reason), I believe this causes imperfections which are masked by motion blur, but is made more obvious when frame interpolation is applied.

On another note, some of my judder consistently occurred at the same time regardless of the source, but I think I figured out the cause of that too. Usually, I have SVP OSD messages disabled, but after enabling them to troubleshoot what was going on, I found out that two judders happened at the same time as two of the SVP OSD messaged. The first judder occurred as SVP was resizing the source video, and the second occurred during black bar detection. After disabling black bar detection and frame size alteration, both of these judders stopped happening.

> > dropped frames 0
> What pan & scan judder do you see?
> The video must move flawless.
I forgot to mention that I refreshed the madVR statistic (Ctrl+r) in the middle of playback. Since the dropped frames (~20 - 35) only occurred at the beginning (due to screen resizing and black bar detection), I didn't think it was relevant to typical playback performance. Of course, I was just ignoring an underlying problem, but that's my fault.

I'm still experiencing dropped frames at the beginning of video playback (~5 - 9), but I haven't got a good explanation for why that's still happening. I think that since I have madVR set to delay playback until the render queue is full, it could be dropping frames until the queue is full. Best guess I've got so far.

All and all, I think the main cause of my judder issues were caused by poor encodes of anime. Thanks for helping me narrow it down, SVP is working much better for me now!